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Feminized seeds, good or bad?

WoodI2
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  I was wondering if feminized seeds are any different than regular female seeds? I keep getting different phenotypes which is fine, but I was wondering if I would have better luck, or less different phenotypes if I used regular seeds and culled out the males? A more naturally made female seed, and not a manipulated one. Or doesn't make any difference at all?

Just smokin' and thinkin.

Maybe I'm completely off here, don't know? That why I'm asking. 😀  

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Topic starter Posted : November 27, 2021 12:29 am
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@woodi2 good question, I'm not sure it matters so much that they are feminized as much as it does the stock they originally came from. I am only really just dabbling in this myself and plan to do some feminized seeds from a few strains I want to keep. I would love to know if it does make a difference or if the variance is something that comes with the genetic code, I understand the clone side of it but I would think that the seeds would have a host of split genetics even if they were feminized as the plant develops those seeds and passes on the desirable genetic traits, so in theory I would think it would become more stable as you bred the more desirable ones through but I'm just high and running with what I know about biology lol. Surely someone on here knows a bit more about it than we do, or at least has some insight into how the genetics are effected via the plants passing down the specific sequencing. It would be a whole other rabbit hole to dive down i think but an interesting rabbit hole none the less.    

I feel like a, like a slice of butter... melting on top of a big-ol' pile of flapjacks... yeah.

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Posted : November 27, 2021 4:26 am
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monkeydo
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From what I’ve read it’s more a situation of how well that line has been worked VS whether it’s a feminized seed. Skunk #1 from Sensi seeds is a decent example of a line that’s been around for a while and has been worked so those seeds are a lot more genetically similar than the very first cross of a line will be. Stabilizing a line can take years but when it’s done well all the seeds will grow very similar plants. You are just trying to get 2 of the same genes in the parent plants instead of a dominant and recessive gene so that every seed expresses the same characteristics. An ideal cross would be a plant with perfectly matched pairs of genes so every seed made would be exactly the same as the parent but we are far from this dream right now.

Random acts of kindness make the world a better place

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Posted : November 27, 2021 2:42 pm
twisted1, BubbleHok, Chillbert and 6 people liked
WoodI2
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Posted by: @monkeydo

Stabilizing a line can take years

Posted by: @bubblehok

I would think it would become more stable as you bred the more

  Thanks for your responses guys. That's where I was heading I guess, but wasn't for sure. Cause my tomato plants from seed do well because of the refined genetics, and I guess we just haven't spent the same amount of time on cannabis seed strain refinement. Comparatively speaking.

  Is cannabis more unstable generically than other plants? Or is it more dominant prevails?

  I guess I'm wondering that when I grow three plants, and their all different looking, (different Phenotypes right?) Which one is the actual strain I was planning on? The one that looks like the picture? How do I know they had the right plant in the pic, and not they're own phenotype? 🤣 But seriously,  And I understand that I don't understand anything about making a pure stable cannabis strain. I just keep think about my tomatoes.

  Anyway, like kids and life, just take what you get and make the best of it. But man, this seeds can go any which direction, maybe photo's will be different? I like what I have, whatever it is. Smile  

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Topic starter Posted : November 27, 2021 3:36 pm
twisted1, Chillbert, BubbleHok and 5 people liked
Chillbert
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Posted by: @woodi2

  Is cannabis more unstable generically than other plants? Or is it more dominant prevails?

great thread first up!

think of cannabis as a million diff plants... just related ... some stable, some not, some somewhere in between..

in order for a plant to be stable it needs some stability (consistancies) its lifetimes (whilst being bred) so it can adapt to its envornment(s) (think this is like evolution!)

modern breeding sometimes (or often) doesnot allow for enough time for projects (new lines or 'strains') to become stable before being released to public imo.... weed seeds have never had to undergo legally required 'regulation' like your tomatoes seeds or their ancestors did at some point .. 

another phase springs to mind ... 'too many cooks ....' and not if the goal is $ then imo we have a conflict of interest and heading towards compromised end products ..

Now, just to flip things on their head... I would hasten to add.. sometimetimes the variety is supposed to be there and is needed and desired...the plant is hugely beneficial in many ways directly because of this variety. A field of a local hierlooms (what people call landraces) in afghanistan, or Nepal, or Malawi, Columbia, Lebanon etc etc often will have several different phenotypical expressions which can include plants that range from full indica type growing traits all the way to sativa type traits.. same strain. Thats not to say they all are different but rarely if ever are they 100% homozygos and a field will contain 'outliers' or plants that display recessive or differing combinations of traits from their historical genepool... 

When looking for 100% cosistancy cuttings are still the preferred method to turn to in many forms of horticulture.. did u know a huge amount of the Cherry blossom trees in japan are the same cutting? so they all go into flower simultaneously the same 2 weeks every year. japanese gardening at its best!

sorry may have tangented a bit there.. where were we? 

Posted by: @woodi2

I guess I'm wondering that when I grow three plants, and their all different looking, (different Phenotypes right?)

keep this one brief.. Yes Smile

Posted by: @woodi2

Which one is the actual strain I was planning on? The one that looks like the picture?

all of them, but if theyre different the strain basically hasnt been finished being made yet... 

i have heard and read (FCP / Breeders rountable episodes) that in cannabis when a strain has been gotten down to 4 or less phenotypical expressions which all carry the desired or aimed breeding traits they can call it a new strain .. this is somewhat at odds with other horticultural bodies like the RHS unsurprisingly 

If you had one that looks like the picture thats something at least.. how many times i wonder have none looked like the pic for people in general? a few too many id guess

Posted by: @woodi2

How do I know they had the right plant in the pic, and not they're own phenotype?

trust issues develop when i dont like what grows outta the seed they sold me or if theyt dont pop

 

Posted by: @woodi2

And I understand that I don't understand anything about making a pure stable cannabis strain. I just keep think about my tomatoes.

ok so a huge reason why we growers experience these differing expressions is because the seeds that breeders choose to cross are not yet themselves stable lines so when crossed they do not produce a 'true F1'. This basically means the gene pool behind the cross (the genetic blueprint being passed around) has too much shit in it (undesired strain genes) that remain causing the new line being created or sold to you and me to have variations and lack the consistancy we want so we can rely on what we've got.

Posted by: @woodi2

Anyway, like kids and life, just take what you get and make the best of it. But man, this seeds can go any which direction, maybe photo's will be different? I like what I have, whatever it is. Smile

living thing retain that element of unpredictability..

glad u like what u found bro Smile

cherish it 

Time to pop some more beans 😗

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Posted : November 28, 2021 9:54 am
Hart, Mr_Kryton, Zombie Nation and 6 people liked

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WoodI2
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  Sir @chillbert has spoken!! Thank you, Thank you and Thank you. This is what I suspected but I don't have the working knowledge of this subject. Thanks so much for this description and explanation of my frustrations. This is why I've tried to stay with reputable breeders Like Sensi Seeds and other older established breeders.

  So maybe I'll just use seeds to learn and prefect my growing skills. Not putting too much concern into what I supposedly have planted. Once I get more of a working knowledge and understanding, even understanding the terminology would be a huge help. LOL Then I can go strain hunting, or just keep growing seeds and keep say "well hello, how are you dear" to each of my nameless seedlings?

I will print this out so I can keep it and reread it when I have the same question again. 🤣 It takes me a couple of times for the info to get through the hard outer layers and into the soft squishy inside part. lol

Thank you Chillbert, your wealth of information appears to be endless and your explanations are irreplaceable. I'm so glad your here. Smile    Hope you have a great day. Please quit the cigs.

 

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Topic starter Posted : November 28, 2021 4:06 pm
Hart, BubbleHok, Zombie Nation and 2 people liked
Chillbert
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Posted by: @woodi2

I will print this out so I can keep it and reread it when I have the same question again. 🤣 It takes me a couple of times for the info to get through the hard outer layers and into the soft squishy inside part. lol

retention is always an issue.. thanks to modern tech we dont really have to now if we know where to look Smile

Posted by: @woodi2

Thank you Chillbert, your wealth of information appears to be endless and your explanations are irreplaceable. I'm so glad your here. Smile

lol thank you kindly but i mostly regurgitate what i see and read from research some of which i relate to my narrow band of experiences on the subjects.. always a student bro and evry days a school day, and always will be ..and im glad for that.. isnt cannabis such a great subject to study?? Smile am glad this is my drug of choice and so much more than just a drug as we all know here 

Posted by: @woodi2

Hope you have a great day. Please quit the cigs.

thank you sir i love my sundays Smile

dont remember the last cig i smoked, i know it tasted shit though 😉

Have a great sunday bro, catch u in HoH later i hope 

Time to pop some more beans 😗

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Posted : November 28, 2021 4:36 pm
Hart, BubbleHok, Zombie Nation and 2 people liked
WoodI2
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Posted by: @chillbert

dont remember the last cig i smoked, i know it tasted shit though 😉

Oh thought you were fighting the habit? My bad, never mind. 😀 I was a slave for years.

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Topic starter Posted : November 28, 2021 5:23 pm
Hart, BubbleHok, Zombie Nation and 3 people liked

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