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Grow Diaries Satzumas Revenge Hunt (Living Soil Bed 10th Cycle)

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Yoshi
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It's been a little while since I did a diary so I thought I'd give it another go as it does help with keeping a record on these pheno hunts.

I had my soil tested after the last cycle and for the 3rd time in a row now I don't need to amend anything the soil is in good balance with maybe a touch too much N towards the end of the last cycle. I did feel that my last run wasn't as good and I noticed a small loss in my hash return % as I only grow for hash. I did notice that being a fair few cycles in with my soil now that the top 8" was basically just castings so I took all of the top layer of soil and mulch off the bed and to the side. Tilled the lower soil layer and mixed in 5% pumice back into the bottom layer to get some more aeration. I then added some peat and pumice mix into the top layer of soil to applied the mulch and am hoping to get things back to where they should be.

As I grow for hash only, Initially I had a long period of searching for a washer and now I have a washer I am able to worry less about my yield so im going to try some of these mini hunts to try and find something with a different terp profile. The goal is to have a few flavours I love that also do well for hash.

This time around I'm mainly hunting for Orange Candy terps in the Satzumas Revenge from Grateful seeds. It's a Mimosa cross with some good hash genetics. In the bed they are the 3 plants in the middle row of the tent (horizontally) and the top left and middle at the back of the bed. The first row are two phenos of Blue Fur Coat from Terp Wizard that I grew on my last cycle but they maybe got swamped a bit by bigger phenos. I wanted to give them another go as there was some interesting smells coming from them. The plant at the back right hand side is Arroz con leche. This was the first pheno I hunted from seed over 2 years ago now and has been a regular for me but I'm loosing a bit of love with it so I'm deciding on this run if its time to say goodbye. 

The Satzuma did will on vigour out of the gate and took to the bed well after transplanting. I have since topped them and today I've cleaned up the lowers and taken two clones from each pheno as I hope to flip to flower at the end of the week after I see them recover and get the vigour back.

I saw some canoeing on my Arroz leaves earlier so I'm hoping its just heat or light stress as it was the tallest plant in there and its been hot over the weekend. I dimmed the lights a bit and turned up the oscillating fan a bit. Hopefully that does the trick as the others seem ok at the moment. 

 

IMG 1095
IMG 1096

 

 

 

 

Grow Space

4x4 Tent

Lighting

Invisible Sun F Bars

Grow Medium
4x4 Living Soil Bed (my own mix lab tested after each cycle)
Seed / Cutting Planted on:
2024-07-15
Nutrients

One application of Soil Food Top Dress from Eco Thrive also use some Trace Minerals from Eco Thrive to.

Picture of Strain
1722256984-SATZUMA-REVENGE-scaled.jpg
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Yoshi
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Day 8 of Flower:

 

I decided to flip about 4 days after my last post. I've seen some stress on one of the phenos with some leaf canoeing. So I dimmed my lights and adjusted the position of the circulation fans a bit. It hasn't really done much and it does feel a little stunted compared to the other plants. I decided yesterday to not trust my blumat moisture sensor and to just give a big soil drench. My thinking was that as I added some new peat mix into my soil along with the aeration perhaps its still a little hydrophobic and the soil isnt holding moisture like it usually has been. So I've given about 20ltrs of water to the bed and for the next couple of days I will still water but only enough to keep the mulch moist and not really get down into the soil. Hopefully that does something but if not maybe this pheno I just one thats not a keeper anyway.

 

Nothing to really report at the moment I've setup my auto watering system as Im going away for a few days soon. Its a combination of blumat drip tape that goes around the perimeter of the bed and then i have 360 degree spray emitters spaced evenly around the bed to try to mimic how I water with a pump sprayer.

 

The first week of the stretch has been reasonably slow but I'm hoping everything will take off over the next week. 

 

IMG 1162
IMG 1164
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Damn Yoshi 10th cycle!? They look like they are about to explode. Nice work. 

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@terppopotamus Yeah man I’ve had the bed for 3 years now so it’s been putting in the work.

 

Thanks yeah actually since I posted this yesterday they have all taken off like I was hoping. The stunted one we will see but the rest looked like they needed that bigger drink 

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Yoshi
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Had a really busy couple of weeks so sorry about the lack of updates but I managed to get some pictures to fill in the gaps.

Day 15 of Flower:

IMG 1233

So I thought before that growth was a bit slow but the surface or the soil was moist. I also had some canoeing on some leaves.

I did a big soil drench and I used some Yucca extract as a wetting agent and that really helped get some moisture to the lower root zone. 

I was going away for a week when I took this picture so I setup my auto watering setup on my wifi timer (I like the flexibility of a wifi plug socket when I’m away).

Day 21 of Flower:

IMG 1330
IMG 1329

This was when I came back. I’ve picked a few leaves off the Blue fur coat at the front but it still feels like the rest of the tent is stretching a bit. I’m gonna wait a few days before I defoliate as I’m usually pretty brutal but as these are mostly new phenos I’m not sure how they will respond with a heavy defoliation so I’m gonna take it easier than normal.

I’m still just using water only with some trace minerals mix that I use on every watering. I also just inoculated the bed with some GOOP from soil smiths. I’ve used this a few times and it’s a great product. 

No real smells to report yet but the blue fur coat is definitely developing the quickest. The Satzumas are all quite uniform in structure and height but some flowers devolving faster than others. One is a little slower than the others but I fim’d that one so think it just took longer to recover.

 

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Yoshi
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Day 39:

IMG 1505

Well its been two weeks since the last update. Some lovely smells have started to come, originally finding some really bright Orange Sherbert on pheno 1 last week but it seems like the brightness is starting to get more earthy now. 

IMG 1496

This grow has been a confusing one for me. In the last weeks I've had some more leaves curling inwards (canoeing) but all leaves still praying hard towards the light. There have been some hot days but RH never went below 45%. The soil is tested and should be fine apart from I added more aeration and one 40l bag of soil mix back into the bed as it needed some more aeration as the top 8" of soil in the bed was just castings.

IMG 1502
IMG 1501
IMG 1503

The plants aren't taking a massive turn but something has defiantly slowed them down but growing in a large volume of soil makes things like this hard to work out. At the moment all I could think was its something wrong with watering and I have done too many large waterings without using the spray nozzle on my pump sprayer so the water has ended up creating an area thats too moist in the lower layers of soil. 

I decided to invest and get some Ecowitt soil moisture sensors I got one for the top soil (top 5") and one that you bury deeper for the lower soil. The data from the sensors do show things are more moist than they should be and particularly in the lower soil (8-10" and lower down). I did stick my hand down in the soil in a few places and where the soil was the most moist lower down was nearest the plants with the canoeing at its worst.

My plan now is to not water but maybe spray the mulch and top soil if it starts to feel too dry but do it slowly in hopes that the lower soil will start to dry out. But over the last 2 days the numbers haven't changed at all which doesn't give me much hope. 

If anyone else has any other ideas I'd love to hear unless its the standard Google search results for leaves canoeing as trust me I've looked at every result on there haha.

Either way these are for hash so its not like all is lost but I defiantly think my yield will be impacted significantly.

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Yoshi
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Day 47:

IMG 1633

 

Well the canoeing hasn’t gone away but it hasn’t gotten any worse. All I can think is it’s potentially some watering issues combined with a bit of environmental stress or maybe defoliation stress.

 

I did think that there could be a small possibility that maybe I had an abundance of springtails that might be disturbing some feeder roots or something. It didn’t seem too likely but regardless I ordered some Rove Beatles and Mighty Mites.

 

I have been trying to get used to my soil moisture sensors and now in the bed I have one Blumat digital meter that goes 9” into the bed. X1 Ecowitt deep sensor that’s about the same level as the Blumat. Then I have two other Ecowitt top sensors at two different sides of the bed.

 

At first I was finding odd readings so I recalibrated all the sensors together and it was showing that my lower soil layers were a bit wet so I really backed off the watering and only did the occasional light watering on the top of the bed. Over a week or so the bottom of the bed has come back to where I wanted it. Now the sensors look like they are giving me decent data and I can see when the plants are drinking more from the top sensor reading. I’m still not watering lots but I am doing it when it’s needed and the surface of the soil looks much more full of life than it has over the last weeks.

 

I’m going to take a soil sample later this week to send off for testing to see if anything needs amending after this cycle.

 

I think my Arroz plant in the far corner has suffered greatly from the issues but the rest of the tent is ok and I should get an ok harvest just not what I was hoping for.

IMG 1615
IMG 1619

 

Now onto the positives.

 

A lot of the plants have started to fade with some also showing some lovely purple to.

 

Most of the Satzumas revenge phenos have a similar terp profile it’s sort of a medicinal candy Sherb and with a hint of orange but they each have a different sort of funk to them.

 

But there is one pheno that just stands out on the terp profile. Pheno 1 is just the purist bright Florida orange. It’s exactly the kind of orange I was looking for as I’m not a fan of the funky marmalade ones I’ve tried before but I once had some bho years ago that had a profile just like this and it was the best daytime smoke. Now I just have to hope it washes reasonably well but I think regardless I’m not going to keep the other phenos and just try to grow some more of this one again.

IMG 1621

 

The other stand out in the tent is Blue Fur Coat. I did a tiny hunt of this on my last run and it got a bit swamped by the other plants in the bed so was small but it smelt amazing so I decided to not wash it and keep it in the freezer and run it again so I’ll wash it all together. If you touch a bud the smell just stays on your skin until you scrub it off and it’s the first thing you smell when you open the tent. It’s intense blueberry with watermelon and a hint of a funk but nothing cheesy more like the funk off a papaya.

 

Either way I can’t wait to see how these come out as hash/rosin I really hope that they do well in the wash as it’d be hard to say goodbye to them.

 

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Mr.Buddster
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@yoshi Now i am very curious as well what may cause this canoeing of the leafs. some strains just have it in their DNA because of too much frost. I had that happen with way too much heat. I hope you can figure it out at some point. 

Nevertheless your plants look amazing like they always do. Keep up the good work

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Yoshi
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Ok so this diary wasn't the best sorry about that. 

Over the last weeks my main tent in my loft has started to fall apart and it made me think it was the time to build a small room in my loft instead of a tent as I want to have better insulation anyway for the coming winter.

I still haven't finished but I have finished a new veg area which I think should help with the issues I've been having with canoeing.

Two weeks ago I sent off a sample of my soil for testing and It came back with slightly lower Phos and Potassium levels and a little lower on Boron but all still in the acceptable range. I will top dress a couple of times this next cycle to sort that out.

So after knowing my nutrition was ok the guys at ecothrive asked me to check my stems and roots. I harvested the tent and checked the roots and had mostly hollow stems which could be related to higher N (which is now a bit lower) and maybe Boron. But I think most of it stems from me keeping my plants in veg in smaller pots for too long. The stems went a bit woody and the roots just didnt take to the bed like they should. 

So that was the main reason for me wanting to change my setup and then make a bigger veg area so I can fit in bigger pots and see whats going on properly.

Im going to wait a few extra weeks this time and reclone some phenos until they look super healthy and happy then I will transplant to the bed and see if this canoeing issue goes. 

The run was not very good for me I had about a 50% loss on my normal yield so I just have to hope I have enough hash to keep me going from this cycle until my next harvest but it might be tight.

 

I'll try and put up some pictures on harvest day soon followed by a smoke report. 

 

 

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That all seems to make sense to me @yoshi. Hope you have enough to last you untill your next harvest and look forward to seeing the new setup.

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@yoshi you don't have to feel sorry. I am always looking forward to see updates of your grow even if it takes a tad longer. Just don't let this small incident get to you too much. We all have our ups and downs. I am curious what you will come up with. Tent or grow room and such... 

I would like to ask you one thing. My ladies are showing slight signs of N toxicity. Any tips or will they fix it by themselfs?

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Yoshi
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@mr-buddster thanks man you have to take these things on the chin and just make more of an effort. I think we all get a bit too confident or lazy at some points. I was too focused on fixing problems in my main tent I forgot about how import a good start is.

The new setup is just going to be all the same gear I had before but in a sectioned off and insulted part of my loft space where the tent currently is. I won’t be upgrading the extraction yet just due to cost but as it’s winter I’m not as concerned.

Excess of things is always hard in living soil. I had an excess of potassium before and the only way I could get rid of it was to add more unamended soil to my bed. But in saying that I don’t like to blindly ammend anymore so if it’s a problem I’d get the soil tested. But if they finish ok then just keep going eventually vegging in there will get the N down. Maybe add some cover crop that doesn’t Nitrogen fix like grasses not clover etc. If you need to top dress or ammend just make sure your not adding more nitrogen sources to.

 

 

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Yoshi
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@mr-buddster oh I also forgot don’t chop and drop your leaves this time around if your N is high either.

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Mr.Buddster
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@yoshi true. I only grow in autumn till spring, summer is too hot for the plants here.

thanks, that are some very good tips. I wont topdress for the next 2 grows i think. but not dropping the leafs is something i wouldn't have thought of. Today my worms arrived and i hope they will start shifting things around and eventually the problem will fix it self. I have the feeling that letting nature do its thing is the best way too go. That's what living soil is for, right?

Right now i am using straw and hay as a mulch layer, i had only bad experience with living mulch. Maybe after growing season i will do a major grow, chop, feed the worms run. 

 

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@mr-buddster In my experience I always have the best or most predictable soil moisture level when I have cover crop and mulch. For my mulch I use wild meadow hay (its basically the cheapest way to find decent organic hay and cheap as chips one bag would last me around 3 years). Then for the cover crop I really don't like a lot of the ones you buy off the shelf as they have grasses that grow long and then you have to maintain the cover crop more than your actual plants. I now use a grass seed called dichondra repens its basically a no maintenance grass thats used for garden areas where people cant mow the lawn. Its not as cheap as the others but at least you dont have to cut it. 

I would say that it might be best for you to til your soil a bit after this cycle and also top dress next cycle but maybe look for a specific bloom top dress so it has a 0 N or as close to 0 as you can find. The thing about living soil is you cant think about the cycle you are on or even the next one sometimes so even adding amendments now might mean they aren't bioavailable until some point in the future specially if you don't have worms yet.

 

 

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@yoshi never thought of using grass😅 you mean take everything out again and shovel through it after the first harvest?? that is a lot of work. i got i bit of 300l of soil in there. 
In my last grow i never top dressed. I thought it's not necessary. The one big benefit of living soil

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@mr-buddster I don't mean as severe as shovel it but basically if you don't have worms in your soil and haven't yet then they aren't helping to aerate your soil for you. They also aren't eating nutrients in your soil and then pooing them out so they become bioavailable to your plants. You just want to remove your mulch then use your hands and til the top 8-10 inches of soil and to be honest id always to this after every cycle. No til is great if your outdoors and can create big fungal networks but its not going to have the same impact indoors if your pulling plants every few months. 

You defiantly need to top dress or amend your soil. Ive had my soil now for over 11 cycles and it took me until the 8th cycle until my nutrition was cycling itself properly. If you dont top dress or ammend your soil in some way it will still get depleted of nutrition eventually and as your in a larger soil volume issues happen slowly so its not as obvious. 

I've said this somewhere on here before but before i started soil testing I had a pheno that washed at 2.8% hash for me. After one soil analysis and one application of amendments I was told to use based on my soil volume and lab results that same pheno went from 2.8% to 5.4% which is huge. Its like getting double the amount of hash from the same flower weight.

I've actually found that AI can be quite useful for this stuff now. So as an experiment I would put into AI your soil volume, the amounts of the ingredients or ratios you used to make the soil, the amount of plants and how long they were in veg and flower and also tell it that you felt N was too high. Then see if it will recommend a top dress or amendment for your next cycle. I actually put my lab results into AI and it came back with some decent info about the differences between my tests and what I might want to try. 

Living soil is a lot easier than dealing with pots and having a big soil volume makes life easy to but I cant recommend testing enough to really know whats going on. 

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@yoshi I'd really love to sit down with you and pick your brain over few hours😅 i will most definitely do so. The thing is i haven't found a proper soil testing facility here in Austria... maybe i need to dig deeper (no pun intended).

Your info is helping me so much. 

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I’m still no expert in any of this there’s way too much information to digest but I have a “soil guy” so all I know is my own experience and the knowledge he points me towards and also podcasts etc. New techniques are constantly being found out to though. 

I can’t find a decent place to test my soil in the UK either. I send a soil sample to the USA every cycle to Logan Labs. If you email them they will direct you on how to send the sample etc. it’s very easy you send the sample and when they have your results they send you an email invoice then you get your results. 

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@yoshi hey, i just saw your answer by accident because i wanted to send you a pm (i will do so in a sec). I actually found a company in austria that does soil tests, i will finish this run and send one off afterwards. top dressed with some flowermix now and KNF stuff. we will see whats going to happen

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Smoke report:

 

Taken a little while but as expected my flower return was very poor. One or two plants did ok but I think all of my issues are down to keeping the plants in small pots for too long so I’ve taken my time and rebuilt my grow space which in the end took me days of graft but I’m happy now to start fresh (apart from my soil of course haha).

 

So I washed the Satzumas Revenge as a mixed wash and the Blue Fur Coat as a mixed wash to as there were 2 phenos of that that I had saved from my hunt in the freezer to combine with this batch.

The two main phenos that made up the Satzuma batch did well in the wash and came back around 3.5% so I think I could push that higher next time. Pheno 1 the bright orange pheno really came through in the end rosin. It’s a bright fresh orange taste with a touch of candy and some earthy notes from the other phenos. I’m running just pheno 1 on its own on my next grow to see how it does on its own as a profile. 

IMG 1932
IMG 1930

Post and Pre whip pics.

The Blue Fur Coat I feel is something special. Again this was a mixed wash so I’m growing my selected pheno again on its own next cycle. When I was microplaning the hash it smelt like Grape Laffy Taffy. When I tried the fresh press rosin it was pure Blue Jolly Rancher American candy terps like that sort of artificial taste but in a good way. Then dabbing in a banger on a hotter temp it really had this strawberry/blueberry profile and now the cold cure is finished it has more of this American candy profile again. I think the fresh press was a little more instense so I’ll see how this cured but it’s a terp monster and you need to change the water in your rig if you want to taste anything else so I’m really happy with that. It also came in around 3.5%. I think I can get this higher as the bud structure lends itself to hash so if I can pack on more size in veg I think I’ll be onto a keeper.

IMG 2059
IMG 2040
IMG 1992

Post Whip/Pre Whip/Fresh Press

 

Im hoping I’ll have enough to last me until me next harvest but at least I’ve found some nice terps.

 

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Well done @yoshi That stuff looks amazing, Nice job man 🙂

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@yoshi Beautiful color my guy. Very lovely

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